Monday, March 12, 2012

Western Culture and Islamic Extremism

In my previous post, Islamic Extremism and Oppression, I touched upon adopting Western accepted norms to bring about attention to solve issues.

I refer to comment by a regular reader going by the name Hashimoto,
"Stoning to death is a punishment for those who had commit adultery. This applied for both the man and woman.

Islam is very strict with regard to adultery. However, I've never heard this punishment being carried out and furthermore the judge will also look into the marital well being of the individuals involved before sentencing."
Of course he was referring to the stoning as a punishment for adultery.

I reiterate that, by choice, I rarely comment on matters related to Islam.

In the question of Hudud laws, I have an issue with amputation and stoning as punishments. I consider it extreme and in saying so will offend not a few of the Muslim faith.

The following report is NOT punishment meted by an Islamic court, this must be made absolutely clear.

In Iraq, Stoned to death for being an emo: NINETY Iraqi students killed for having 'strange hair and tight clothes'

A group of armed men dressed in civilian clothing led dozens of teenagers to secluded areas a few days ago, stoned them to death, and then disposed their bodies in garbage dumpsters across the capital, according to activists, activists told the Cairo-based al-Akhbar website.

The armed men are said to belong to 'one of the most extremist religious groups' in Iraq.

'First they throw concrete blocks at the boy's arms, then at his legs, then the final blow is to his head, and if he is not dead then, they start all over again,' one person who managed to escape told Al-Akhbar.
Western vested interests have achieved democracy in the liberation of Iraq. This has led to a more open Western culture in Iraq, it would seem, and consequences by religious extremists.


Anonymous said...


First, the most important thing is that since you are a christian, "hudud law" do not applies to you . It only applies to Muslim. Islamic court or Syariah court cannot sentence a non-muslim using Hudud Law even if PAS won the election. You do not need to take my word for it, you can ask other muslims.

Second, even if PAS won the election, they will not be able to change the constitution in parliament that will enable "Hudud Law". This is "impossible" and this is a fact.

So the "hudud" issue is a political tact by incumbent government in particular MCA to create anxiety to the masses with regard to the alternative government.

Third, they are not many amputated muslims running around this planet. This proves that, amputation rarely being implemented in Islamic court to Muslims.

The judges in Islamic court are not insane people. They will only sentence the maximum penalty for extreme cases.

The Saudis are famous in carrying out beheading in public but this applies for the death penalty and the Saudis adopt different Islamic teaching (Wahabi) compared to us (Sunni/Syafie). So they are different.

I do not see the relevance in your example about the case in Iraq. Over there, they even behead their enemies. That is a violent part of the world which have very serious problems and issue. This have nothing to do with Islam.

Islam is not about hudud law.


Freddie Kevin said...


Firstly, I will accept your word and other Muslims that Islamic laws apply only to Muslims. However, just because hudud laws does not apply to me and applies only to Muslims does not mean that I cannot consider any law, hudud or otherwise, to be extreme. Just the same as I consider hanging in Malaysia, execution by firing squad in China or a bullet to the head in Russia, all as extreme.

Secondly, in politics nothing is impossible. You are right PAS cannot change the constitution on it's own. Pakatan Rakyat can - by concensus, together with PKR and the DAP. Then and again, even if the laws apply only to Muslims, it will not change my view. Should I think less or differently for a fellow Muslim Malaysian or any Muslim even when the law is judiciously applied? No. Will it mean that Islam is an extreme religion? Again no. Islam as I understand and believe is a forgiving and beautiful religion.

Therefor, if you ask me to chose between the DAP or MCA, surely I will opt for the MCA.

Thirdly, even if there was only one Muslim person amputated for a crime committed, it does not alter my view.

I never said that Islamic judges are insane. Even if they did pass such a sentence, amputation or stoning, I cannot call them insane nor can I say it is wrong because that is the law. But surely I can say the punishment is extreme, even in extreme cases.

Neither did I broach or relate to Saudi Wahabism, Sunni Islam and Sufism in my post. Or beheading, which is also extreme.

What relevance are you alluding to? The post has nothing to do with Hudud laws. Please read carefully.

Yes, it has nothing to do with Islam and Islam is definitely not about Hudud laws.

It has to do about actions carried out by Muslim religious extremists, making Islam extreme, in the eyes of the world.

Freddie Kevin said...


Anonymous said...


There are extremist in any religion. During the Spanish Inquisition, thousand are burned alive in Spain. In France, Joan of Arc were burnt at the stake for heresy.

Burning of humans were never implemented in Islam. There were amputation done in the past but this is not about stealing a loaf a bread. The crime involved armed robbery where injuries to innocents were inflicted.

Stoning to death were also done in the past. Those days, adultery bring dishonor to a person and family and may even lead to tribal war. The frequent misconception to non-muslim is that stoning to death were done only to the female, that is not true. That is why I corrected you earlier.

I really do not want to take this path of comparing religions.

About the death penalty, I disagree with you. I support the death penalty.

John Steinbeck, a famous author wrote in his book "East of Eden" that one is able to observe the physical handicap of human as some unfortunate people were born without arm or leg. It is also possible that some human were born without a conscience. They do not know what "good" is, like color blind people who do not know the color red.

These kind of people may bring misery to others. Some commit heinous crimes, and therefore death penalty is needed in place for these people.

On politics, I agree with you that anything is possible but the probability of hudud law ever being accepted in Parliment is less then 0.01%. DAP will reject it and PKR had indicated that they do not support it and even PAS have move towards "welfare government".

What is important as politics is concerned that now there is viable "two party system" in place. The government start to be nice to the people unlike before. The tone of the government is different and even money is given to the people.

I hope we don't go back to before.

It is nice to have Tesco and Carefour in Malaysia. If one is expensive then we go to another. Both competing to serve the customers better.



Freddie Kevin said...


There is extremism in every form.

I do want to correct you on the political acceptance of Hudud by any party.

Religionwise, I said earlier matters concerning Islam I leave it in the Muslim domain.

As for the death penalty, you make an assuption again. I am not against the death penalty, it is the method I am against.

It does not matter to me what system of democracy we practice, what is important is the Govt takes good care of it's people.

I am in the midst of a post, coincidently, touches upon some of what you comment.

Always appreciate your comments.


Freddie Kevin said...


"I do not want to correct you on the political acceptance of Hudud by any party"